Okay, so I am tired of people in IT positions deciding that it is OK to steal software. ie: buy one version of MS Office and then use it on all their computers. Or find ripped software of any kind and use it. I have heard the term "blessing from God" in relation to this stuff too many times. Just because we are Christians doesnt give us any right to steal, or just because the company makes millions of dollars doesnt make it right to take from them. Especially as people in leadership in these areas we need to walk in integrity in it. Ever considered asking for a donation?
Comments
Integrity
I have to say that i agree. i doesnt matter if it is the mis-use of a postal stamp or the illegal use and copying of music and software it is just not in line with God's character... does it show a lack of faith that God would supply?
Mind the Gap
Unfortunately name brand software is sold around the world at western prices. The result is that in many non-western countries the cost of ms office can exceed 3 or more months of an ordinary person's salary.
This means that in the non-western world purchasing one licensed copy of ms office is approximately the same level of purchase as a western person buying a 5 year old mid-sized car.
In this kind of situation what is a believer to do? Should they stop using their computer?
Just last week a pastor from a non-western country approached me and asked me about this very issue.
My response was this...
* Work towards license compliance, take steps, but don't allow the devil to bring condemnation.
* This year sort out one application so that you are in compliance with its license
* Consider viable freeware and open source alternatives
This approach, of course, would not resonate with ms but seemed to resonate with him.
dont use name brand software
dont use name brand software then. simple. you cannot afford to buy a jet to fly people to outreach so steal one? you see that your line of thinking breaks down very quickly.
can i sell drugs to buy a church organ? what does integrity mean?
I have to say that I cant
I have to say that I cant agree with you except on one point.
* Consider viable freeware and open source options
The reality is that there is NO reason to steal software. There ARE good options out there that are free.
I personally use Open Office 2.0 which can open MS documents and read them and even convert and use them. It can also save as PDF which is a very helpful tool for file sharing. I use this because I cant afford to use MS software at home either.
You bring up two issues, one that God cant or wont provide for your needs. God is bigger than western or not, so if you NEED to use MS software then He will be able to provide what you need in an integrous way.
The second being that you are giving permission to people to take what is not theirs. The laws written in the software are plain. If you cant comply, then dont use it. I would love to drive a mercedes for a vehicle but I cant afford it. So I drive a 50cc Scooter. Not steal a new luxury car.
Of Software Integrity
I feel that I can fall into both camps, really. I don't condone the use of illegal software, yet there have been times when I have used some myself. But, as we can all agree, our walk with the Lord is not perfection from the start. We have to work out our salvation, while all the time we are saved (but that's whole other theological topic).
My point, though, is that I agree with the approach of using open source or freeware when it's possible, but I would also strongly encourage donating *something* to those developers.
Sometimes, though, as I'm finding in the multimedia realm, it's nearly impossible to find any good open source or freeware alternatives, so that's where I have to look at developing a budget to allow the purchase of such programs that would get the job done.
I think the bottom line is that computers have made us lose the art of patience and waiting for a good thing. So, the struggle comes in being patient and waiting until you can afford a legal copy of a software title. In many ways, the project that's depending on this piece of software is not going to die if you don't get it and get it now. Plan out your projects and your approach to accomplishing them. If there's an open source or freeware title that will help you get it done, please be happy and use it and donate when possible.
Chris Bischoff
YWAM Latvia, Communications
www.ywamlatvia.com
www.chrisandlydia.net
Different people think different
I am sick of discussions about licencing.
If someone is tempted to use one licence on multiple machines, why not using free software. Ask yourself if you really need MS Office or if OpenOffice can do the same for you.
I would say for 99% of the work free programs can do the same the expansive brands. I know that for some things it´s impossible (Flash), but even for most people a graphic tool like GIMP is way too powerful to handle all features, so why using Photoshop?
If you are still too tempted use Linux. I heard that it´s lately pretty easy to install and use. As far as I know there is no Software available to buy for Linux, so no temptation.
The acctual question I have is, why should I spend money anyway, when I can get stuff for free?I don´t know how much support you guys have, but there is no way for me to buy even just MS Word. So, I use OpenOffice. Even if I had money, I still would by StarOffice. Why should I buy something when I can get it cheaper (MS vs. StarOffice). The money I would save buy this, I could spend in programs where there is absolutely no free option (Flash, etc...).
I, as a missionaries supporter would be a bit angry if "my" missionary runs out of money when buying a big MS Office package.
The other thing is, right now we as YWAM might get a good price for MS products. What if MS dicides to stop that discount from one day to another, but my whole environment is depended on MS? Poor me!! I saw such kind of a scenario already. I better search for Open Source Software now and am happy to save a lot of money, even if I could afford this or that.
I have a MS Word 95 licence left over. Anyone in need?
Greetings from the MatriX,
neo
Perspective
True, various versions of Linux have become much easier to install (i.e. MEPIS or Ubuntu, etc.), but I know from personal experience, even those that I just mentioned, are not totally fool-proof & unless you have some experience, you'll find yourself spending a LOT of time researching search engines, etc. to get things like sound cards to work.
Linux is very much a viable option for simple desktop usage (i.e. email, document creation, internet browsing, etc.), but when it comes to more advanced uses (i.e. video editing, audio editing), it's still very underdeveloped & will remain so for a few more years.
As I said before, I would *strongly* encourage donating to open source projects, such as OpenOffice because the majority of the time, those programmers creating those open source projects donate tons of time to it & many times quit their full-time jobs to devote all their time to their projects. If you donate, then you will help them to develop their projects even further.
If I were a missionary supporter & "my" missionary had to spend my support on software that would allow them to do the job that they are called to do, then I would consider that to totally be a viable use of my support. Besides, the reality in supporting a missionary is that you as the supporter are giving to God & the missionary is receiving from God. If you leave God out of the middle, then the supporter becomes the source of supply to the missionary, which is unbiblical & unhealthy... but I digress.
Bottom line, as I mentioned before, if there are open source or freeware options that will satisfy your technology needs, by all means use them & try your best to support them. However, if you can't find titles in those areas that will effectively help you get your job done, then by all means spend the money. On this, I believe we are saying the same thing.
Technology is totally a worthy use of your personal or corporate missionary budget. The whole reason YWAM isn't more developed in the area of technology is because of just the sort of thinking that it's not worth putting into the budget.
Thanks for your excellent input.
Blessings,
Chris Bischoff
YWAM Latvia, Communications
www.ywamlatvia.com
www.chrisandlydia.net
Please get me right in this
First of all, I know that we can´t leavr God out of the middle, that´s why I wrote --"my" missionary-- instead of --my missionary--. Please recongnize the quotes.
My piont was another one. Also get me right here please. I am not against buying brand software. If you need it for your work, you need it. My question is, what do I really need for my work?? Do I need Word, Excel, etc because everybody is using it? If you are a designer you probably need Photoshop or InDesign. However, I don´t need Word or InDesign to write a newsletter to my supporters. I would say that most people don´t use the potencial of a free program. So why buying a more powerful Software, which basicaly has more feature I don´t use?
Word and OpenOffice can do the same things. OpenOffice also creates PDF files, a big advantage compared to Word. I think that we need to re-think the WHY getting this or this piece of Software.
I guess that a lot of people expect that others expect them to have the same Software, also I discovered that a lot of people think that they can not do their work or comunicate with others if they don´t have this or that program. What freedom it would be if we, as YWAM could communicate that we don´t have to have all the brand Software, that Open Source can do the same and that it´s not evil, like a bigger company tried to tell people that it is. I believe that we could set people free to buy the Software they really need, incl. having enough licences, if they use Open Source, Freeware, Shareware in those areas were they don´t need the so called Industry Standard.
As I said earlier, I believe that a program like GIMP is able to do more than most people are needing a graphic program for. The same with OpenOffice, the Mozilla Foundation is coming up with a calendar solution calles "Sunbird" that looks pretty powerful to me, e-Sword, a powerful Bible program, etc.
Linux.
I don´t know if Linux is underdeveloped. Video, Graphic and Audio editing is working very well on a Mac. In fact, for Audio editing a Mac is still the best way to go. Mac OSX is based on FreeBSD which is based on Unix, so is Linux. I would say the companies are afraid that they don´t get enough money when porting their Software to Linux. I can understand it from a business piont of view. A noneconomical product sooner or later can bring the whole company down. That´s not wise to do, however, I think Linux as OS has the same desktop power like Windows or Mac.
However, I have a laptop and will check ASAP (this year or next year, I don´t know) one of those Linux options you linked to. Then I will see how easy it is to install and/or get the Hardware working. I wanted to do that anyway. However, I think video or sound card is not the big deal, more interesting might be a wireless adapter or USB devices. I actually don´t know if or how Linux is supporting USB devices. Plug and Play or is it more like Plug and Pray? I will find out.
Greeting from the MatriX,
neo
Linux
I completely agree with you regarding Linux having the same desktop power as Windows & Mac, & if you look back at my last post I said that you can totally do everything office-related on Linux. The problem you run into on Linux is when you go beyond office-related computing & start trying to get into audio & video editing. From personal experience, there just *is not* any viable solutions for those types of uses, unless you have tons of time & don't mind hacking your way through Cinelerra to edit a professional video or Ardour to record professional multi-track audio. In order to get these to work, again from personal experience, you have to pray that you'll find just the right device driver for your audio card or ieee-1394 firewire port & videocamera. I'm describing a bit of an extreme example, but not an uncommon one. There is hope with these programs for these uses, but just not yet.
There is *some* promise with Scribus as a professional desktop layout alternative to InDesign, PageMaker or QuarkXPress. However, again from experience, it is sorely lacking in a lot of areas. Yes, it is actually possible to produce a 4-color brochure ready to be printed at your nearest offset printshop, but it requires some work to get there.
Again, I completely agree with you about Mac being a far superior product for multimedia use. I wish I had one! ;-)
Again, from personal experience, Linux will still not give a 100% guarantee that usb & wireless adapters will work "out of the box". However, there is a small program available for Linux made specifically for wireless adapters called NDisWrapper. The entire purpose of this program is to allow you to run Windows-based drivers for your wireless adapters. This is due to the fact that some wireless adapter companies will not release their hardware specs to the public, so that open source folks could write Linux drivers. Usually this program is shipped already installed with any newer version of Linux.
For USB devices, I know at least MEPIS will recognize them at boot-up, but I've never experienced any plug-n-play operability. Also, you'll usually have to either manually mount them, or find the right program that was written to interact with that specific device.
I've found that, overall, MEPIS has a much higher amount of driver support for different devices than does Ubuntu. After working with both, MEPIS turned out to be easier to get a pc running than with Ubuntu. However, Ubuntu has much better support documentation available than does MEPIS. But I found that the guys on the MEPIS IRC channel (irc.freenode.net #mepis) were ready to help with issues. So, I think after you experiment with them, it'll come down to your preference which you like best. MEPIS uses the KDE desktop, whereas Ubuntu uses the Gnome desktop.
I think we are saying the same things just from a slightly different perspective. In our office here in Latvia, most of the computers are running Linux. But I can tell you those have not gone without problems... but then again... neither have the Windows pc's either! ;-)
Cheers,
~Chris
Chris Bischoff
YWAM Latvia, Communications
www.ywamlatvia.com
www.chrisandlydia.net
Linux on a laptop
OK, so I was sitting the last weekend the whole time at my desk and tried to install Linux on my laptop and compared the installation with installing Windows. They are working now both on my laptop pretty well, maybe I need to install some more software, but I am able to work woth both systems. Yes, they are installed parallel on my computer.
To be honest, I found it easier to install Linux, I installed Kubuntu, because the system was useable right away. Windows, it's W2k cause I can not afford a newer version, I needed to install the graphic card, sound, network, USB, etc. Basically a whole lot of work was needed to get a running system.
Installing Linux was much easier. I needed to choose and format the partion, the same knowledge is needed for Win installation, enter some names and passwords, like in Win, and thatÅ› basically it. The system came with a whole bunch of software, USB, sound, graphic, etc. was working. I had access to my network and the internet right away, no extra installation or setup needed.
Well, I know that W2k is comapred to a up-to-date Kubuntu version pretty old. However, I have no idea why people are still afraid of installing Linux. Things are working different, that's true, but it's something what everybody can learn. At least everybody who learned to install Win and programs for Win. It's not highly complicated or something like that.
By all means, I am not a Linux Guru, see my questions regarding Linux in other Blogs. I just learned at some piont how to install Windows, and I find it, with up-to-date versions, pretty easy to install Linux, too.
In fact, I'm writing this message right now with Linux and also listen to some nice mp3's.
I would also, like Chris, like to get Mac. I got some ideas for recording music, however, the sound card would cost as much as other people spend for a computer, so I am even far away from dreaming to be able to afford that. But with getting a OS for free, a whole lot of software, etc. it's way easier to save some money to hopefully make this dream (one day) come true.
Greetings from the MatriX,
neo
Personal Conviction
We all have to be careful in this...as it is a lot bigger than we imagine...God has been speaking to me about my music and films that I have that I don't own....I ended up buying and/or deleting all the songs which I didn't own the rights to listen to...I also ended up spending a lot of cash on purchasing registrations for a few very used (by me) programs.
In Brazil, there is so much piracy, it's often easy for YWAM to start following suit...we need to stand against the lies of the enemy...if we DON't have an official license to use Windows XP, then we DON'T use Windows XP...as simple as that.
On another note, as UofN training locations, we should all be entitled to Educational or Special User license agreements etc on software. I know that the Lausanne base buys many licenses at a discount...I believe the rest of the YWAM world should be entitled to this. It would certainly help us in Brazil.
Tim Edwards
YWAM Curitiba, Brazil.
EFL, Genesis, IT Admin.
Definately a Hot Subject!
This certainly seems to be generating a lot of comments.
To put in something about your question about discounts for software purchases David Couper put a post on this site that you might want to read about software discounts from Microsoft:
Microsoft Select
In addition, like you said, our base gets a lot of educational discounts on software from different corporations, plus we also get discounts from some hardware manufactures as well since we are an educational instute.
My transition from 100% pirated to 100% genuine
Hey guys,
A few months back I was in gathering down in Perth, Auz when a friend began to talk about integrity in software usage. I'll admit, I was a bit sceptical. But after hearing again from Schmale himself a few months later, I began to think (and then, finally, pray) about the idea of moving over to legit software.
I think all it really takes is a bit of determination (and maybe conviction). I also had the bad luck (just kidding) of someone keeping me accountable in this area... and I was challenged to make a decision one way or the other.
I started by listing all my pirated programs by name. Creative Suite CS2, Adobe Premiere, Macromedia stuff, MS Office, etc, etc... Then I figured out the retail costs, which totalled about $3000 USD. I told my wife I was willing to give it all up IF God could replace it it. She sorta stared at me in shock and said, "Really? You're only gonna do it if God meets YOUR conditions?" When I realized how dumb that idea was, I decided to get rid of it all and give it a go, and then see what would happen. I figured it was up to me to obey what I felt God was saying and then let him provide IF he wanted.
That was 6 months ago. I was broke then and had no cash for buying software.
Since then I have reformatted my hard drive and made a fresh start. I use absolutely NO pirated software, I've destroyed pirated disks that I bought in Bangkok, I bought an Academic version of MS Office on eBay for $99, I use a horribly outdated version of CorelDraw 9 (which I despise, but will use until I can afford Adobe), and have begun collected some really cool freeware and shareware programs that I absolutley love.
All in all, I am glad I did this. After all, if God isn't able to provide or chooses not to, then I sure as heck shouldn't be in this line of work that requires such software. But as He does provide, it only confirms to me His interest and owndership of the ministry that I do.
Cheers!
Dan B
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"God doesn't call the qualified...
He qualifies the called"